Mar 22, 2020, 8:43 PM I spent years on the analytic, logical, operational, and empirical to climb through the ladder of disciplines one ring at a time, and finally reach the end – religion and aesthetics. And the conversation followed a predictable trajectory. An indifferent “Huh?” to “Yes, yes” enthusiastic engagement. Everyone wanted me to work on philosophy, secular theology, and religion BEFORE I constructed the scaffolding underneath it – so that I wasn’t hanging on priors – just the truth. … Now watch as everyone else reverts to prior despite all the work. You know why? No one, or almost no one, ever learns, adapts, changes, evolves. We want power over our mind, our emotions, our environment, and others. And we want it on our terms. And we want the grammar our brain wants. We want any excuse to confirm our priors. Because the cost of cognitive reconstruction is too high. Can you help it? No. You will gain the ability to speak about your bias in more precise terms. You will adopt the parts of P that solve problems for you – explanatory power or justification of priors. You will imitate those who you can benefit from. And those of us for whom truth is enough, were destined to be here all along. We just know how to speak the truth now in the language of truth: the laws of nature, the natural law, and the law of evolution and transcendence. Intuition is a jealous elephant. ( Our consciousness is not just a rider on the elephant of our intuition, on the landscape of our genes. The elephant is not just undisciplined. it jealously guards its independence from our consciousness. )
Source: Original Site Post
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The Goal of Freemasonry?
Mar 22, 2020, 8:51 PM by Scott De Warren I don’t see Freemasonry as an attempt to create a masculine rational Christianity so much as an attempt to break down the barriers between the three Abrahamic cults through common ritual, hierarchy, and esoteric symbolism/teaching of man’s potential transcendence rooted in Egyptian, Babylonian, Phoenician temple traditions where rudimentary science and esoteric teachings about man were taught to male initiates.
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The Goal of Freemasonry?
Mar 22, 2020, 8:51 PM by Scott De Warren I don’t see Freemasonry as an attempt to create a masculine rational Christianity so much as an attempt to break down the barriers between the three Abrahamic cults through common ritual, hierarchy, and esoteric symbolism/teaching of man’s potential transcendence rooted in Egyptian, Babylonian, Phoenician temple traditions where rudimentary science and esoteric teachings about man were taught to male initiates.
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The Case Against and For
Mar 23, 2020, 11:31 AM Rik, This piece helped me understand you a little better. Your book helped me understand you a little better. I finally understand what you are doing and why. And I understand your investment in the literary frame. My question is whether literary frames are causes, justifications, or excuses. Whether we obtain information from speech, text, and empathy, or from observation, evidence, and incentives. Or stated differently, from ideas or evidence. It seems you work from the literary(spoken, empathic, monopoly, ideal) model, and not from the evidentiary(observation, incentive, markets, adaptive) model. And whether intuition, sympathy, and empathy are to be fed, or whether they are to be TRAINED. My position would be that as we evolve into increasing complexity we must maintain adaptability, and we must invest in additional training, not in greater accommodation of our animal instincts. and that we are failing to produce that training. And that the training can be achieved by non-false narrative (fairy tales, myths, legends, history, of princes and princesses which we want all to aspire to be as the ideal) and that stoic self authoring, epicurean philosophy of joy with others, and living within your means, tripartism/trifuctionalism, and basic economics and basic natural law can be taught to literally everyone at some level of sophistication. Military service makes men unselfish. Motherhood makes women unselfish. Adversarial education and military realism, naturalism, and empiricism produces men fit for governance. Adversarial courts and the law teach people real manners, ethics, and morals where indoctrination fails. It is pretty obvious from history we can do what I recommend without negative externality, while we can pretty much burn the entire abrahamic project and all within it as drugging the population with false promise that led the jews to mysticism achieving nothing but parasitism, the muslims to mysticism destroying every advanced civlization of the ancient world, and christianity producing a dark age of ignorance we escaped by rule of law, commerce, literacy to take advantage of it, the conquest of the world for having done so, but where we are still trying to escape. Buddhism producing a pseudoscientific or pre-scientific stoicism of withdrawal rather than action, and all other than epicureanism and shintoism producing a mythology of suffering or evil rather than joy. Whether you study the supernatural literature(lying), the philosophical literature(deceiving), or the demographic, economic and military literature (evidentiary truth), you will come train yourself to rely on the constant relations within that paradigm of lying, deception, or truth. That does not mean you cannot convey group strategies or some variation on group strategies through indoctrination(social construction), justification, or evidence. You can. it’s just more costly to train the animal to have a human mind instead of satisfying the animal intuition of a child. And to produce very different externalities for having done so. So, given we know that we must satisfy the demand for religiosity given the lack of agency as empathy and neuroticism increase in dominance of an individual’s personality, it’s a matter of paying the cost of training them, or paying the cost of retraining everyone else to be an adult. Now, that said, it is very easy to pick a hero and imitate that hero. For people with empathy jesus is an almost optimum hero. For people who are neurotic and empathic jesus is still an optimum hero, but they also need stoic discipline whether on the buddhist woo woo or the stoic ritual methods, and prayer by discourse, or prayer by repetitious stanzas all work just fine, depending upon the degree of neuroticism we need to suppress. You’re saying you want what you understand. I’m saying the market needs whether it understands or not. This is not under my control either. I am from a long line of lower aristocracy, soldiers, and puritans (church of england > Puritan > Congregational). When I read books, poetry, the lives of, and letters by my puritan american and anglo ancestors, and the records of my norman ancestors, and I realize that just as they wanted the falsehoods of rome, priests, dogma, and institutions out of their lives, that I am merely continuing the tradition, of wanting theology, priests, their lies, their myths, their superstition, their corruption, and their parasitism, out of our lives – because the physical laws of nature, the natural law of man, and the necessary law of evolution and transcendence are the only laws in the universe not corrupted by the deceits of man. Gods exist in the minds of man as intergenerational, fictional, archetypal kings, headmen and fathers of our peoples. But if there is a universal deity – a ‘God’ then we have the evidence of his hand in the writing of his hand, in the physical laws of nature, the natural law of man, and the necessary law of evolution and transcendence. And that is all there is to be said. those laws are either obeyed and they are not. We do his work or we do the demon’s work. It does turn out however, that jesus’s teachings are the optimum prisoner’s dilemma strategy and that they are therefore the optimum cooperative strategy INTERPERSONALLY, when the christian himself performs the analysis and the charity – but not politically, when he proxies others do do it for him (her). So by that reasoning I include the teachings of jesus in the natural law – they are just, like many of the laws of the universe, counter-intuitive. THE HIERARCHY OF INSTITUTIONAL DEPENDENCIES Genetic Intuitions … Demographic distributions … … Homogeneity-heterogeneity … … … Means and organization of production … … … … Demands for, means of, method of military order – or it’s failure … … … … … Group Strategy under all of the above: producing metaphysical (presumptive) value judgements … … … … … … Mythology to persist that strategy … … … … … … … Mothers, teachers, Priests, to indoctrinate into that mythology and strategy. … … … … … … … … Education to indoctrinate you OUT of that mythology and back to the strategy (Academy). … … … … … … … … … Institutions that enforce and persist that military, economic, social, and familial strategy. … … … … … … … … … … Institutions that evolve and adapt that strategy to change. As far as I know this cannot be false.
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The Case Against and For
Mar 23, 2020, 11:31 AM Rik, This piece helped me understand you a little better. Your book helped me understand you a little better. I finally understand what you are doing and why. And I understand your investment in the literary frame. My question is whether literary frames are causes, justifications, or excuses. Whether we obtain information from speech, text, and empathy, or from observation, evidence, and incentives. Or stated differently, from ideas or evidence. It seems you work from the literary(spoken, empathic, monopoly, ideal) model, and not from the evidentiary(observation, incentive, markets, adaptive) model. And whether intuition, sympathy, and empathy are to be fed, or whether they are to be TRAINED. My position would be that as we evolve into increasing complexity we must maintain adaptability, and we must invest in additional training, not in greater accommodation of our animal instincts. and that we are failing to produce that training. And that the training can be achieved by non-false narrative (fairy tales, myths, legends, history, of princes and princesses which we want all to aspire to be as the ideal) and that stoic self authoring, epicurean philosophy of joy with others, and living within your means, tripartism/trifuctionalism, and basic economics and basic natural law can be taught to literally everyone at some level of sophistication. Military service makes men unselfish. Motherhood makes women unselfish. Adversarial education and military realism, naturalism, and empiricism produces men fit for governance. Adversarial courts and the law teach people real manners, ethics, and morals where indoctrination fails. It is pretty obvious from history we can do what I recommend without negative externality, while we can pretty much burn the entire abrahamic project and all within it as drugging the population with false promise that led the jews to mysticism achieving nothing but parasitism, the muslims to mysticism destroying every advanced civlization of the ancient world, and christianity producing a dark age of ignorance we escaped by rule of law, commerce, literacy to take advantage of it, the conquest of the world for having done so, but where we are still trying to escape. Buddhism producing a pseudoscientific or pre-scientific stoicism of withdrawal rather than action, and all other than epicureanism and shintoism producing a mythology of suffering or evil rather than joy. Whether you study the supernatural literature(lying), the philosophical literature(deceiving), or the demographic, economic and military literature (evidentiary truth), you will come train yourself to rely on the constant relations within that paradigm of lying, deception, or truth. That does not mean you cannot convey group strategies or some variation on group strategies through indoctrination(social construction), justification, or evidence. You can. it’s just more costly to train the animal to have a human mind instead of satisfying the animal intuition of a child. And to produce very different externalities for having done so. So, given we know that we must satisfy the demand for religiosity given the lack of agency as empathy and neuroticism increase in dominance of an individual’s personality, it’s a matter of paying the cost of training them, or paying the cost of retraining everyone else to be an adult. Now, that said, it is very easy to pick a hero and imitate that hero. For people with empathy jesus is an almost optimum hero. For people who are neurotic and empathic jesus is still an optimum hero, but they also need stoic discipline whether on the buddhist woo woo or the stoic ritual methods, and prayer by discourse, or prayer by repetitious stanzas all work just fine, depending upon the degree of neuroticism we need to suppress. You’re saying you want what you understand. I’m saying the market needs whether it understands or not. This is not under my control either. I am from a long line of lower aristocracy, soldiers, and puritans (church of england > Puritan > Congregational). When I read books, poetry, the lives of, and letters by my puritan american and anglo ancestors, and the records of my norman ancestors, and I realize that just as they wanted the falsehoods of rome, priests, dogma, and institutions out of their lives, that I am merely continuing the tradition, of wanting theology, priests, their lies, their myths, their superstition, their corruption, and their parasitism, out of our lives – because the physical laws of nature, the natural law of man, and the necessary law of evolution and transcendence are the only laws in the universe not corrupted by the deceits of man. Gods exist in the minds of man as intergenerational, fictional, archetypal kings, headmen and fathers of our peoples. But if there is a universal deity – a ‘God’ then we have the evidence of his hand in the writing of his hand, in the physical laws of nature, the natural law of man, and the necessary law of evolution and transcendence. And that is all there is to be said. those laws are either obeyed and they are not. We do his work or we do the demon’s work. It does turn out however, that jesus’s teachings are the optimum prisoner’s dilemma strategy and that they are therefore the optimum cooperative strategy INTERPERSONALLY, when the christian himself performs the analysis and the charity – but not politically, when he proxies others do do it for him (her). So by that reasoning I include the teachings of jesus in the natural law – they are just, like many of the laws of the universe, counter-intuitive. THE HIERARCHY OF INSTITUTIONAL DEPENDENCIES Genetic Intuitions … Demographic distributions … … Homogeneity-heterogeneity … … … Means and organization of production … … … … Demands for, means of, method of military order – or it’s failure … … … … … Group Strategy under all of the above: producing metaphysical (presumptive) value judgements … … … … … … Mythology to persist that strategy … … … … … … … Mothers, teachers, Priests, to indoctrinate into that mythology and strategy. … … … … … … … … Education to indoctrinate you OUT of that mythology and back to the strategy (Academy). … … … … … … … … … Institutions that enforce and persist that military, economic, social, and familial strategy. … … … … … … … … … … Institutions that evolve and adapt that strategy to change. As far as I know this cannot be false.
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The Market For Justifying Low Agency
Mar 23, 2020, 11:54 AM THE MARKET DEMAND IS FOR “AN EXCUSE TO HAVE LOW AGENCY WHILE STILL FEELING GOOD ABOUT MYSELF AND EVEN FEELING SUPERIOR TO OTHERS”. by John Mark I’ve been pondering along these lines, don’t have full answer fleshed out yet by any means. A couple things I’m confident of:
- Asking Christians to “keep their faith private” will piss them off. Won’t work. For the reason Daniel gave. It’s a monopoly religion – “If you don’t believe, you are evil and going to hell.”
However, it’s not a monopoly religion (in America today’s version) that tries to force itself on you (there’s no “believe or we’ll kill you”), they believe conversion must happen by genuine persuasion.
If we do (continue) what Bill describes regarding keeping faith out of the courtroom, and just implement P-law (enforce reciprocity), where nothing is an excuse to violate reciprocity or bait the public into hazard, (I think) we can let Christians keep the outward expression of their faith & let them “evangelize” (they’re not winning many/any converts in the west anyway by the way) but if they cross the line into irreciprocity/baiting into hazard, they find their butts in court like anybody else. This combined with “reciprocal christianity is real christianity” could work. In limited experimentation in convos with rightwing-instinct Christians, they “get” reciprocity and fairly quickly give into my total intolerance for irreciprocity & hazard baiting. Cuz it makes sense to them & they quickly realize “my faith can’t contradict reciprocity or it’s nonsensical & harmful”.
We high agency unadulterated truth-speakers cannot compete with Christianity in terms of persuading the low-agency/intuitive/emotional crowd (spectrum chart Curt posted last couple days). My wife still attends church, she watched online service yesterday by a somewhat well known preacher – sermon addressing coronavirus situation using bible verses & “God told me” type stuff. It was masterful. Mix of stoicism (fine) with bible verses loosely interpreted (classic trick) and supernatural claims, humor injected, total alpha vibe “I’m not afraid, I’m full of joy”. Messages:
“God will protect you.” “You don’t have to be afraid.” “We Christians are the only ones full of joy and not afraid during this time.” (Effective out-grouping of anyone attempting to think rationally and act with agency during the crisis. Excuse for lack of agency presented as a positive.) “The Bible foretold this” (quotes a Bible prophecy about pestilence/plague and people being afraid.) “God is accomplishing a purpose through this – He is purifying His church” (provides meaning -answers “why is this happening?”). (Common tactic – anything bad that happens is presented as punishment/correction for bad people.) Again, this provides excuse for low agency and encourages it – why fight God’s will? This stuff is like crack for the low agency. I talked to my wife about it and she admitted I was right. She is pretty high-agency for a woman and high IQ and ultra right wing, understands baiting into hazard but I can tell it is still like removing an addiction. Imagine what it is like for a lower-agency person,medium-low IQ to hear us talk. For comparison, our message, the unadulterated truth:
- No one is going to help you except you, and your immediate family, and our fellow grassroots rightwingers.(Did God save millions of christians in soviet russia from being killed by the commies? No. So what guarantee do we have that He’ll help us?)
The only reason this is happening is that there are too many crappy people in the world (e.g. chinese peasant wet markets, chinese govt face-before-truth liars, and/or elite scumbags), and we have not sufficiently separated from and/or eliminated them.
The only meaning this event has is as a wake up call to the consequences of not doing that.
It is our responsibility to fix this.
Notice that every one of our points demands high agency. Which they are either incapable of, or need a lot of training for. If given a free market choice, they will choose the “excuse for low agency” message every time over ours. And this is the problem I don’t know how to solve: How to lead such people without lying to them, and/or provide them a religion/mindfulness that does not lie to them. Because what they demand is lies – which are their excuse for low agency. Removing the lies removes the very reason they are attracted to the religion in the first place. (There are exceptions, high-agency Christians exist and for them Christianity operates as just a pre-packaged “defense container” for conservative instincts – but most Christians their religion is also an excuse for low agency.) Maybe it is possible to provide a lie-free mindfulness “religion” or version of Christianity that promotes agency rather than reducing it, but who will buy it? The actual market demand is for “an excuse to have low agency while still feeling good about myself and even feeling superior to others”. Edit
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The Market For Justifying Low Agency
Mar 23, 2020, 11:54 AM THE MARKET DEMAND IS FOR “AN EXCUSE TO HAVE LOW AGENCY WHILE STILL FEELING GOOD ABOUT MYSELF AND EVEN FEELING SUPERIOR TO OTHERS”. by John Mark I’ve been pondering along these lines, don’t have full answer fleshed out yet by any means. A couple things I’m confident of:
- Asking Christians to “keep their faith private” will piss them off. Won’t work. For the reason Daniel gave. It’s a monopoly religion – “If you don’t believe, you are evil and going to hell.”
However, it’s not a monopoly religion (in America today’s version) that tries to force itself on you (there’s no “believe or we’ll kill you”), they believe conversion must happen by genuine persuasion.
If we do (continue) what Bill describes regarding keeping faith out of the courtroom, and just implement P-law (enforce reciprocity), where nothing is an excuse to violate reciprocity or bait the public into hazard, (I think) we can let Christians keep the outward expression of their faith & let them “evangelize” (they’re not winning many/any converts in the west anyway by the way) but if they cross the line into irreciprocity/baiting into hazard, they find their butts in court like anybody else. This combined with “reciprocal christianity is real christianity” could work. In limited experimentation in convos with rightwing-instinct Christians, they “get” reciprocity and fairly quickly give into my total intolerance for irreciprocity & hazard baiting. Cuz it makes sense to them & they quickly realize “my faith can’t contradict reciprocity or it’s nonsensical & harmful”.
We high agency unadulterated truth-speakers cannot compete with Christianity in terms of persuading the low-agency/intuitive/emotional crowd (spectrum chart Curt posted last couple days). My wife still attends church, she watched online service yesterday by a somewhat well known preacher – sermon addressing coronavirus situation using bible verses & “God told me” type stuff. It was masterful. Mix of stoicism (fine) with bible verses loosely interpreted (classic trick) and supernatural claims, humor injected, total alpha vibe “I’m not afraid, I’m full of joy”. Messages:
“God will protect you.” “You don’t have to be afraid.” “We Christians are the only ones full of joy and not afraid during this time.” (Effective out-grouping of anyone attempting to think rationally and act with agency during the crisis. Excuse for lack of agency presented as a positive.) “The Bible foretold this” (quotes a Bible prophecy about pestilence/plague and people being afraid.) “God is accomplishing a purpose through this – He is purifying His church” (provides meaning -answers “why is this happening?”). (Common tactic – anything bad that happens is presented as punishment/correction for bad people.) Again, this provides excuse for low agency and encourages it – why fight God’s will? This stuff is like crack for the low agency. I talked to my wife about it and she admitted I was right. She is pretty high-agency for a woman and high IQ and ultra right wing, understands baiting into hazard but I can tell it is still like removing an addiction. Imagine what it is like for a lower-agency person,medium-low IQ to hear us talk. For comparison, our message, the unadulterated truth:
- No one is going to help you except you, and your immediate family, and our fellow grassroots rightwingers.(Did God save millions of christians in soviet russia from being killed by the commies? No. So what guarantee do we have that He’ll help us?)
The only reason this is happening is that there are too many crappy people in the world (e.g. chinese peasant wet markets, chinese govt face-before-truth liars, and/or elite scumbags), and we have not sufficiently separated from and/or eliminated them.
The only meaning this event has is as a wake up call to the consequences of not doing that.
It is our responsibility to fix this.
Notice that every one of our points demands high agency. Which they are either incapable of, or need a lot of training for. If given a free market choice, they will choose the “excuse for low agency” message every time over ours. And this is the problem I don’t know how to solve: How to lead such people without lying to them, and/or provide them a religion/mindfulness that does not lie to them. Because what they demand is lies – which are their excuse for low agency. Removing the lies removes the very reason they are attracted to the religion in the first place. (There are exceptions, high-agency Christians exist and for them Christianity operates as just a pre-packaged “defense container” for conservative instincts – but most Christians their religion is also an excuse for low agency.) Maybe it is possible to provide a lie-free mindfulness “religion” or version of Christianity that promotes agency rather than reducing it, but who will buy it? The actual market demand is for “an excuse to have low agency while still feeling good about myself and even feeling superior to others”. Edit
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Everything a (((libertarian))) Says Is a Lie.
Mar 23, 2020, 12:08 PM
–“Property is dirived from the axiom of self ownership ie, we own ourselves. External property is defined by labor investment – either direct labor such as, “I made this walking stick” or indirect labor such as “I bought this walking stick” or also indirectly as a title gift as “I was given this walking stick” or by contract such as, “I am making payments on this walking stick.””—JWarren Prescott
No. Property is the result of seeking cooperation, trust, loyalty, and non-conflict between warriors dependent upon one another under the strategy and tactics of voluntary entrepreneurial warfare using maneuver. Sovereignty, and once we have sovereignty, reciprocity is required. From that all western civilization arises. Now what is difference between the PRESUMPTION of an impossibility of the sophistry of ‘self ownership’ and the evidentiary necessity of sovereignty and reciprocity among voluntary warriors (see organization of piracy). The difference is using the sophistry of self ownership to circumvent the need for a universal militia responsible for creating sovereignty and reciprocity from which property is the result. Everything a (((libertarian))) says is a lie. Let me say that again
(a) everything a libertarian says is a lie. (b) every philosophical argument is a lie. (c) if you cannot construct an argument from physical and natural law it’s a lie. (d) people lie.
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Everything a (((libertarian))) Says Is a Lie.
Mar 23, 2020, 12:08 PM
–“Property is dirived from the axiom of self ownership ie, we own ourselves. External property is defined by labor investment – either direct labor such as, “I made this walking stick” or indirect labor such as “I bought this walking stick” or also indirectly as a title gift as “I was given this walking stick” or by contract such as, “I am making payments on this walking stick.””—JWarren Prescott
No. Property is the result of seeking cooperation, trust, loyalty, and non-conflict between warriors dependent upon one another under the strategy and tactics of voluntary entrepreneurial warfare using maneuver. Sovereignty, and once we have sovereignty, reciprocity is required. From that all western civilization arises. Now what is difference between the PRESUMPTION of an impossibility of the sophistry of ‘self ownership’ and the evidentiary necessity of sovereignty and reciprocity among voluntary warriors (see organization of piracy). The difference is using the sophistry of self ownership to circumvent the need for a universal militia responsible for creating sovereignty and reciprocity from which property is the result. Everything a (((libertarian))) says is a lie. Let me say that again
(a) everything a libertarian says is a lie. (b) every philosophical argument is a lie. (c) if you cannot construct an argument from physical and natural law it’s a lie. (d) people lie.
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A European Syncretic Religion Is Possible
Mar 23, 2020, 12:45 PM 1) It is absolutely possible to create a framework for the spectrum of european ‘religions’ and a pantheon. 2) It is absolutely possible to produce a non-false, syncretic, european religion. 3) It is absolutely positively possible to institutionalize those religions – gradually. 4) it is absolutely positively possible to teach physical and mental fitness, and the three sets of laws in ordinary education, decreasing the demand for falsehood. 5) There is absolutely positively demand for it – especially among men – and it will only increase. 6) It will take less than a century to succeed.